The Hindu Business Line : `Muslims must pursue modern education'

In a backward State like Bihar, "its 16 per cent Muslims are even more backward," says Mr Shafi Mashhadi, Vice-Chairman, Bihar Urdu Academy and former member of the Bihar Public Service Commission. Talking to Business Line in Patna recently, he said Muslims must to hold protests seeking education. "Above all, we need to retrieve Muslims from the clutches of the mullahs," he said.

Excerpts from the interview:

What is the status of Muslims in Bihar?

Bihar has a population of nine crore of which 1.54 crore, or 16 per cent, is Muslim; 85 per cent live in rural areas, and only 8 per cent of the Muslims have landed property of over two acres. The majority are landless or marginal farmers. But they can't survive on agriculture and so either take to other professions or migrate to Punjab, Gujarat, etc. Bihar is backward but Muslims are more backward among the backward. Their educational status is dismal; over 4,000 madrasas are helping to some extent, but it is only religious education.

Don't you think the madrasas should get modernised?

Of course. Unless they modernise and along with religious education offer some vocational education, they'll not survive. Recently, the Sachchar Committee had come here and wanted concrete proposals on modernising madrasas and we've given suggestions.

But the main problem of Muslims is that they don't get employment; government employment is limited and they don't get jobs in the private sector. Most Muslims survive on self-employment; they run small puncture repairing or other shops.

In Bihar, there are 22 lakh Muslim boys in the 11-14 age group and 32 lakh in the 6-14 age group. Of them hardly 40-45 per cent go to school, which means about 18 lakh Muslim boys are yet to get into schools.

Isn't the noon meal scheme an attraction?

There are schemes but where is the implementation? In Bihar there is a huge gap between what they say and what they do.

As for higher education, only boys from privileged classes in the urban areas make it. We were calculating the other day that if you want all Muslim boys in schools, we'd need 12,000 primary schools and 60,000 teachers!

Actually the education system itself has collapsed here; a three-year course takes five years to complete. Exams are not held on time, results not published.

What about girls' education?

The position is much worse. We had thought female literacy in Bihar would be in single digit, but through manipulation etc, you can take it to 15-20 per cent. So if 80 per cent mothers are illiterate what is the future of the children?

What is the Muslim psyche here?

It is a matter of concern. Because of the backwardness and deprivation there is a withdrawal symptom among the community, a frustration ki kuch nahi hona hei. Padke kya karna hei, naukri nahi milegi hamei. (Nothing will change; what is the use of studying, anyway we won't get jobs.)

We formed an organisation called FLAME (Forum for Literacy Awareness and Muslim Education) in 1996.

We try to be a catalyst but the problem is so huge that one organisation cannot tackle it. Bihar has 14 universities but not a single professional or technical university. We've requested the Chief Minister and he's agreed to set it up shortly.

For 17 years we've been running an engineering college as a minority institution but there are huge problems such as renewing affiliation every years and a four-year course takes six years to complete!

Talking of the Muslim psyche, Mr Lalu Prasad always claimed to be a messiah and said he never allowed communal riots in Bihar...

And he was successful.

With the BJP in the coalition, are the Muslims now concerned; are memories of the communal carnage in Gujarat still fresh?

Oh yes, there were apprehensions no doubt, but that has subsided because of the attitude and rule of Nitish Kumar. He is a secular person and he's been trying to keep BJP under control. But if Nitish had contested this election alone, he would have got a majority on his own.

But why did Muslims get alienated from Mr Lalu Prasad?

People were just fed up; how long can you feed people only on promises without acting on them. No doubt Muslims are very obliged to him; he inculcated a sense of security in them. But after you feel safe, roti bhi chhahiye, education bhi chhahiye.

What do you feel about the future of Bihar?

I'm an optimistic; but it is optimism with a bit of caution because Bihar has been languishing for the last 55 years and is one of the most backward regions of the country.

What about the future of Bihari Muslims?

As good as anywhere in India... I don't include the South because things are better there.

Do you think the Muslim mindset also has to change?

Definitely, unless we ourselves change nobody can help us; there is a Koranic aayat (verse) which says those who don't want to change, even God doesn't change them.

In what ways should Muslims change?

First, pursue modern education. Be progressive and retrieve the masses from the clutches of the mullahs and maulvis... because these people, in the name of religion want to keep people illiterate to retain their hold on the masses. They are exploiting the masses. Unless we develop a modern outlook skewed towards scientific education, there is no future for us. And we have to come into the mainstream. This doesn't mean we have to forget our religion or culture.

But then that has to be kept at home, in the personal domain...

Sure; let's decide that I'll fast, pray, and do everything my religion tells me to do, but at the same time I'll go for Phsyics, Chemistry, Computer technology, etc.

And we have to learn to be more tolerant of other religions?

Exactly. We are highly intolerant; talking about Bihar, we have seen here a lot of protests and processions, lathi charge and firing in the Shah Banu case, and more recently against the cartoons. But there has been no protest or movement for education. I haven't seen a single procession of Muslims saying ki humko taleem dau (give us education).

But then as you said it is the mullahs who encourage and trigger all this?

Yes, but the mullah is only a tendency... an attitude of mind. A friend of mine in Delhi gave a good definition of a maulvi... jo apni duniya aur aapki akhiriyat ke liye fikarmand ho, wohi maulvi hei. (A maulvi is one who is worried about his present existence, and yours after death.)

Unfortunately, we are living in times when anybody can grow a beard, wear a pagdi and become a mufti! But the media is also exploiting these weaknesses and presenting the Muslim community in a very bad light... terrorism, triple talaq and polygamy. But do you know that the 1961 Census — after which figures on polygamy were not published — stated that polygamy among Muslims is 4.7 per 1000, among Hindus it is 4.8 per 1,000, Buddhists over 14, Jains over 6, and Adivasis over 16? Even then Muslims are whipped all the time on the polygamy issue.

Response may be sent to rasheeda@thehindu.co.in