How ?

The foreign-type harassment was only replaced by the desi variety.

How long did you stay in Mussoorie? What about your business responsibilities?

My wife spent nearly two years in the hills, though intermittently. During winter she would come back to Delhi. But I could not accompany her all through. I had to be in Calcutta. I was looking after the hosiery division of the Kesoram Cotton Mills in Calcutta, though father was at the helm of the group’s entire business. Hosiery was a profitable business at that time; there were huge government purchases particularly during the war years. We subsequently withdrew from hosiery as the industrial scene changed and the smaller units were encouraged to come.

Are you against small units?

Not if they are efficient. Unfortunately, many of them are not. Even long years of government protection have not been of much help. In a competitive environment, what is critical is efficiency, not necessarily the size.

What was the scene like at the time of Independence?

The industrial scene at the time of Independence was very different from what it is today. The war, thanks to large-scale government purchases, had given a boost to the economy but there were not many big industrial houses. The effective size of the economy was small, so was the number of Indian industrialists, and foreign capital still held sway. Uncertainty, which started immediately after the war, continued for some time even after Independence. This was presumably because the new government’s policies were still to crystallise. The situation began stabilising from the mid-1950s.

Your assessment of Pandit Jawaharlal Nehru?

Panditji was a great person, visionary, idealist and honest. He played a pivotal role in the country’s freedom movement. However, after Independence he became obsessed with mixed economy tinged with socialism. Industries were allowed to grow only with licences granted selectively, often grudgingly. The government itself stepped into several fields, precluding the entry of private sector in those fields. In fact, there were all kinds of restrictions. The licensing system stunted growth because to get a licence one had to wait for months, even years, and that too after spending considerable time in the corridors of power with folded hands.

Was the situation like this right from the beginning?

No, it was not so in the beginning. I must say, the first few years of Independence were not that bad. Perhaps the idealism that triggered the freedom movement still persisted. The situation started changing for the worse gradually. For getting government permission, only patience was not enough; sometimes other means such as greasing of palms had to be adopted. This was precisely the reason why Aditya chose to do business outside the country. He started with Indonesia and then expanded his activities to several other countries. Kumar, Aditya’s son, of course has further expanded the overseas business and the group now is present in more than 20 countries.

How would you describe the last 60 years?

In my opinion, the last 60 years can be broadly divided into three distinct segments — Nehru era, Indira era and liberalised era. I would rather refrain from commenting on the Indira era, which was a difficult period politically as well as economically. Populist measures, one after another, did enough harm to the economy and, with it, to the business and industrial sectors. Politically, the senior leaders, many of them freedom-fighters, were thrown behind bars. Now, when I look back, I feel that nearly 30 years were lost.

What about the liberalisation era?

Liberalisation since the early 1990s has thrown up new opportunities. New sets of entrepreneurs are coming with new ideas and new technology and, more importantly, there is no dearth of funds to support them. The integration of the Indian economy with the world economy has posed new challenges with the result that knowledge, skills, competition and efficiency are the new buzzwords. Competition has led to efficiency, lowering of prices and improved availability of products. I’m now 87, and also expanding my own businesses. A new tyre unit will be launched in north India and cement unit in the south; even existing units are undergoing expansion. The time is indeed very exciting.

Do you think freer entry of foreign capital has harmed local businesses?

No, I do not think so. There might have been some difficulties initially, but ultimately consumers benefited, the government benefited and, on the whole, the economy benefited. Look at the kind of change that has overtaken the consumer goods sector. Leading international brands are now available to common people at affordable prices. This was unthinkable in pre-liberalisation period.

Turn to the capital goods sector. As soon as the steel sector was thrown open to private investment, there was a long queue of investors keen to put in money in the manufacture of iron and steel and, remember, the size of investment in a steel plant is large and so is the gestation period. Oil, power, fertiliser, cement, transport, the list can be long and there is no dearth of funds for investment anywhere.

And why should we restrict foreign capital when our own people are going abroad in large numbers for investment? Kumar has gone outside and he hopes to do very well, the Tatas are very active on foreign soil and there are many others like them. As an Indian, I’m a firm believer in the capability of my countrymen. There is hardly any field now, science, arts, culture, entrepreneurship, education, where our people are not making a mark at the global level.

Who was your role model?

My father was my role model and I tried to follow him totally. I was, to my estimate, 80 per cent successful. My son did not follow me, perhaps rightly so, and Kumar’s style of functioning is still different. I’m not surprised. The world has changed, the working environment has changed and the rules of game have changed. And the very different style has paid off. As you know, Kumar is very successful.

How would you rate the performance of the present government?

It will be wrong to presume that I support everything of the present government. But I see a great future for the country. There will be ups and downs, but ultimately water will find its own level. The secular trend is in an upward direction. I’m a diehard optimist. In a few years from now, I’d say only four countries — US, Russia, China and India — will rule the world economy. I will not be there to see it. But as an Indian I feel very proud of the country’s future prospects.

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